New Buffy-verse Convert

[Ropespor]

Okay, so I'm a latecomer to the Buffyverse. I never actually saw it while it was airing. But over the past two years, I've watched all 144 episodes. And now I want to start watching them all over again. These characters have become a part of my life. I love 'em. I even ordered the Buffy musical soundtrack. And now I'm reading the "Season 8" comics. So count me a convert.

http://ozment.livejournal.com
http://manning.coldfusionvideo.com
www.myspace.com/ozmentshouseoftwilight (http://www.myspace.com/ozmentshouseoftwilight)

[erazmus]

It took you long enough, prof.
Mike

Michael D. Turner
'Psyched Up' in _Turn the other Chick_-ed. E. Friesner-Baen books
www.baen.com
'Dutchman Rescue'in Continuum SF #6
www.continuumsciencefiction.com/orders.htm (http://www.continuumsciencefiction.com/orders.htm)

'An Incident at Black Tongue Tavern' in _Bash Down the Door and Slice Open the Badguy_ from Fantasist Enterprises:

www.fantasistent.com/books/anthologies/BASH.php (http://www.fantasistent.com/books/anthologies/BASH.php)
'Stains' in Tales of the Talisman 3-1 www.zianet.com/hadrosaur/index.html (http://www.zianet.com/hadrosaur/index.html)
'Slushpiles' in Between the Kisses
www.samsdotpublishing.com/betweenkisses/TurnerSlushPileS.htm (http://www.samsdotpublishing.com/betweenkisses/TurnerSlushPileS.htm)

[Jeff Stehman]

Better late than never. Most days I prefer Angel to Buffy, as my high school days are a wee bit behind me, but it's all good.

A good time killer is to watch all the significant Wesley scenes, from his first appearance in Buffy to his final scene in Angel. His transformation makes him my favorite character in both series.

--Jeff Stehman

[Ropespor]

I'm about 3/4 of the way through Season Four of _Angel_. I'm excited about James Marsters joining the cast in Season Five--Spike became one of the most interesting character arcs for me.


http://ozment.livejournal.com
http://manning.coldfusionvideo.com
www.myspace.com/ozmentshouseoftwilight (http://www.myspace.com/ozmentshouseoftwilight)

[erazmus]

They didn't get the mileage out of him in Angel that I'd first hoped. When you finish season five, you can join us in speculating about the survival possibilities of the remaining cast.

Mike

Michael D. Turner
'Psyched Up' in _Turn the other Chick_-ed. E. Friesner-Baen books
www.baen.com
'Dutchman Rescue'in Continuum SF #6
www.continuumsciencefiction.com/orders.htm (http://www.continuumsciencefiction.com/orders.htm)

'An Incident at Black Tongue Tavern' in _Bash Down the Door and Slice Open the Badguy_ from Fantasist Enterprises:

www.fantasistent.com/books/anthologies/BASH.php (http://www.fantasistent.com/books/anthologies/BASH.php)
'Stains' in Tales of the Talisman 3-1 www.zianet.com/hadrosaur/index.html (http://www.zianet.com/hadrosaur/index.html)
'Slushpiles' in Between the Kisses
www.samsdotpublishing.com/betweenkisses/TurnerSlushPileS.htm (http://www.samsdotpublishing.com/betweenkisses/TurnerSlushPileS.htm)

[jason]

Nicholas-
If you just can't get enough there are also the trade paperbacks Fray, Tales of the Vampires, and newly released Buffy Omnibus vol. 1--all buffy/slayer related graphic novels (dare I say comic books). That Mr. Whedon has a deft hand at character and if you are a fan of his story telling, have you seen Firefly?
I'll butt out now...

Jason Thummel

"Mortismagus" in Magic and Mechanica, Ricasso Press Fall 2007

[Ropespor]

Jason, Firefly's next on my list. Too bad it was cancelled after one season...


http://ozment.livejournal.com
http://manning.coldfusionvideo.com
www.myspace.com/ozmentshouseoftwilight (http://www.myspace.com/ozmentshouseoftwilight)

[jason]

Indeed. I was rather late in seeing it myself, only after it became available on dvd...and went on sale. In any case, well worth the time--great stories, wonderful characters. It is difficult to understand how shows like it are cancelled while others seem to linger far past their potential, if ever they had any. Perhaps it was the lack of a laugh track. In any case, I think you'll enjoy it.

Jason Thummel

"Mortismagus" in Magic and Mechanica, Ricasso Press Fall 2007

[bleacheddecay]

erazmus said...
They didn't get the mileage out of him in Angel that I'd first hoped. When you finish season five, you can join us in speculating about the survival possibilities of the remaining cast.

Mike

I agree. I had such a wonderful idea of where they could have gone with Spike on Angel. He was the only one who didn't sell out to evil. How amusing if he'd become the conscience of the group.

I've always liked Spike far better than Angel btw. If you look at who they both were pre-embrace it's clear who was the 'better' man.

I also miss Lyndsey. He was evil but nice eye candy. He was also a multi layered evil character.

bleacheddecay

[erazmus]

::spoiler alert::
But did either survive that alley in the end?
Mike

Michael D. Turner
'Psyched Up' in _Turn the other Chick_-ed. E. Friesner-Baen books
www.baen.com
'Dutchman Rescue'in Continuum SF #6
www.continuumsciencefiction.com/orders.htm (http://www.continuumsciencefiction.com/orders.htm)

'An Incident at Black Tongue Tavern' in _Bash Down the Door and Slice Open the Badguy_ from Fantasist Enterprises:

www.fantasistent.com/books/anthologies/BASH.php (http://www.fantasistent.com/books/anthologies/BASH.php)
'Stains' in Tales of the Talisman 3-1 www.zianet.com/hadrosaur/index.html (http://www.zianet.com/hadrosaur/index.html)
'Slushpiles' in Between the Kisses
www.samsdotpublishing.com/betweenkisses/TurnerSlushPileS.htm (http://www.samsdotpublishing.com/betweenkisses/TurnerSlushPileS.htm)

[bleacheddecay]

I'm not sure we are supposed to conclusively know the answer to that. I think it was left up in the air.

Everyone looked rough but I personally refuse to see Spike gone.

bleacheddecay

[Jeff Stehman]

erazmus said...


::spoiler alert::

But did either survive that alley in the end?
In the commentary, Joss basically said, 'They're Angel and Spike. They'll probably find a way to survive.'


bleacheddecay said...
I've always liked Spike far better than Angel btw. If you look at who they both were pre-embrace it's clear who was the 'better' man.
That was obvious throughout. Spike had always been contaminated by love. Angel was evil through and through. Angel had his soul forced upon him. Spike fought for his. My wife and I figure something went wrong with his conversion, leaving a lot more of the original--a poet at heart--than normal.


bleacheddecay said...
I also miss Lyndsey.
Lindsey was a lot of fun. Loved the song he sang, too. But grumpy-side-of-the-force Wesley is still the coolest in my book.

--Jeff Stehman

[bleacheddecay]

Wesley was interesting to watch evolve. I was glad to see they let the character develop but he was a bit to whiny and gritty to be coolest in my book. The best part for me of him was when he was with the delectable Lilah! Now that was hawt.

bleacheddecay

[erazmus]

Faith was the coolest charcter in that universe, followed by Ann the center chick. And the Illyria and Harmony, in that order.

Way I see it, Harmoney dropped a dime on the sit after she left the office and slayers showed up before the alley got too lethal for the good guys-- though Gunn is toast.

Mike

Michael D. Turner
'Psyched Up' in _Turn the other Chick_-ed. E. Friesner-Baen books
www.baen.com
'Dutchman Rescue'in Continuum SF #6
www.continuumsciencefiction.com/orders.htm (http://www.continuumsciencefiction.com/orders.htm)

'An Incident at Black Tongue Tavern' in _Bash Down the Door and Slice Open the Badguy_ from Fantasist Enterprises:

www.fantasistent.com/books/anthologies/BASH.php (http://www.fantasistent.com/books/anthologies/BASH.php)
'Stains' in Tales of the Talisman 3-1 www.zianet.com/hadrosaur/index.html (http://www.zianet.com/hadrosaur/index.html)
'Slushpiles' in Between the Kisses
www.samsdotpublishing.com/betweenkisses/TurnerSlushPileS.htm (http://www.samsdotpublishing.com/betweenkisses/TurnerSlushPileS.htm)

[bleacheddecay]

I agree with you about Faith!

Love her motto: 'Want, Take, Have!'

*smiles*

Illyria had COOL hair. That, for me was her main strength. Her blank look was irritating though.

Harmony was really irritating but amusing in her own way. She sort of reminded me of Darla or Glory. Later she became much more fun.

I don't remember Ann.

That everyone wanted to have both Cordelia and Fred was too incestuous to me.

I loved Lilah.

Hated Darla, and Spike's first squeeze, what her her name? The crazy one? Drucilla, that's what it was.

I liked the policewoman character. She just went pfft. Why?

I also loved Lorne.

I hated that they killed off Doyle the first season.

I hated Connor. Want to hear a relationship from hell, Connor and Dawn can you imagine? *chuckles* That would be horrible!

bleacheddecay

[erazmus]

The guy playing Doyle died of cancer or something-- didn't he? They had just enough notice to give the character a heroic send off. The policewoman wasn't polling well I think. Drucilla is the key to everything, including understanding Joss's cosmoslogy. I thought Fred and Cordellia should have been a couple, leaving everyone else to take cold showers.

Faiths best line was 'Stand away from the glass.'

No one ever remembers Ann. She's the strongest, coolest and bravest character portrayed in either show, and she's in both.

And I thought they should have done more with the were wolf girl. Like get her a tutor-- Oz?

Mike

Michael D. Turner
'Psyched Up' in _Turn the other Chick_-ed. E. Friesner-Baen books
www.baen.com
'Dutchman Rescue'in Continuum SF #6
www.continuumsciencefiction.com/orders.htm (http://www.continuumsciencefiction.com/orders.htm)

'An Incident at Black Tongue Tavern' in _Bash Down the Door and Slice Open the Badguy_ from Fantasist Enterprises:

www.fantasistent.com/books/anthologies/BASH.php (http://www.fantasistent.com/books/anthologies/BASH.php)
'Stains' in Tales of the Talisman 3-1 www.zianet.com/hadrosaur/index.html (http://www.zianet.com/hadrosaur/index.html)
'Slushpiles' in Between the Kisses
www.samsdotpublishing.com/betweenkisses/TurnerSlushPileS.htm (http://www.samsdotpublishing.com/betweenkisses/TurnerSlushPileS.htm)

[bleacheddecay]

I never heard that about Doyle. I heard they though his character was too much like Angel.

I loved Oz.

Remind me who Ann is? Please?

Cordelia made me sick by the end of the show but Fred and Willow could have been hot IMO.

I also liked the girl in red who had some special electrical power. What happened to her?

bleacheddecay

[erazmus]

Ann started as a vampire wanna-be groupie in a Buffy episode, who Buffy saved from being eaten by Spike and his gang.
The when Buffy ran away to LA (the first episode in season three) she ran into Buffy and the two of them were kidnapped into a hell dinension. After Buffy freed them, she(Buffy) decided to return to Sunnydale and gave the girl (who changed her name every few boyfriends, apparently) her job and, at her request, the name Ann, Buffy's middle name that she'd been using in LA.
When next we see Ann, she's running a shelter for homeless children in Angel. In the last episodes, Gunn uses his last day to help Ann move furniture to her second shelter to make room for new in her first. That's who Ann is.

Mike

Michael D. Turner
'Psyched Up' in _Turn the other Chick_-ed. E. Friesner-Baen books
www.baen.com
'Dutchman Rescue'in Continuum SF #6
www.continuumsciencefiction.com/orders.htm (http://www.continuumsciencefiction.com/orders.htm)

'An Incident at Black Tongue Tavern' in _Bash Down the Door and Slice Open the Badguy_ from Fantasist Enterprises:

www.fantasistent.com/books/anthologies/BASH.php (http://www.fantasistent.com/books/anthologies/BASH.php)
'Stains' in Tales of the Talisman 3-1 www.zianet.com/hadrosaur/index.html (http://www.zianet.com/hadrosaur/index.html)
'Slushpiles' in Between the Kisses
www.samsdotpublishing.com/betweenkisses/TurnerSlushPileS.htm (http://www.samsdotpublishing.com/betweenkisses/TurnerSlushPileS.htm)

[bleacheddecay]

Oh yeah! She was pretty cool! Thanks for reminding me. I thought she might be attached to the shelter but I didn't remember that she was also in Buffy.

bleacheddecay

[Jeff Stehman]

erazmus said...
Faiths best line was 'Stand away from the glass.'
Agreed. And Robin's best line was directed at Faith: 'Oh, please. I am so much prettier than you.' The first time we saw that episode, we had to pause it until we stopped laughing.

Doyle was written out of the show due to the actor's drug problems. He overdosed a couple of years later.

Ann was unusual in that, after her second episode, life kept getting better for her. She was happy, which in Joss's universe, usually means your life is about to suck. Not for her, though.

I really liked Detective Lockley, in part because she was never comfortable around Angel, even before she know what he was. Once she found out, she was neither his friend nor his enemy. Tough lady.

Darla I liked because she was usually reserved (on Angel, not on Buffy).

I never liked Lorne's singing. Hallett has the skills, but I don't like the timbre of his voice.

Come on now, who doesn't love the Groosalugg? He's like a big puppy dog who slays demons for breakfast. Yet wise.

And Dennis the ghost. Another sweetheart.

Whatever happened to that uber-rich geek that was in a couple of episodes of Angel? I was disappointed he didn't show up again. It felt like they were setting him up for some plot point, but then passed on it.

--Jeff Stehman

[erazmus]

Angel has that problem, especially early in each of the first three seasons-- they haven't decided where they are going.
They just dropped, without resolution, so many great characters and plotlines.
The were-wolf girl
The electricity girl
The software billionaire landlord
The groosalugg (grew-a-slug we called him, for his eyebrow)
Handsome Dennis the poltergeist
Detective Lockley
The crazy slayer
It is a very frustrating show that way.
Mike

Michael D. Turner
'Psyched Up' in _Turn the other Chick_-ed. E. Friesner-Baen books
www.baen.com
'Dutchman Rescue'in Continuum SF #6
www.continuumsciencefiction.com/orders.htm (http://www.continuumsciencefiction.com/orders.htm)

'An Incident at Black Tongue Tavern' in _Bash Down the Door and Slice Open the Badguy_ from Fantasist Enterprises:

www.fantasistent.com/books/anthologies/BASH.php (http://www.fantasistent.com/books/anthologies/BASH.php)
'Stains' in Tales of the Talisman 3-1 www.zianet.com/hadrosaur/index.html (http://www.zianet.com/hadrosaur/index.html)
'Slushpiles' in Between the Kisses
www.samsdotpublishing.com/betweenkisses/TurnerSlushPileS.htm (http://www.samsdotpublishing.com/betweenkisses/TurnerSlushPileS.htm)

[Ropespor]

Say, did anyone notice the apparent homage in the Groosalog character's being called "Groo"? His name, original characterization as a dim warrior, and (native) costume seem all to allude to Groo, the hapless barbarian in the Sergio Aragones comic book.


(It wouldn't be the first time the writers of BUFFY and ANGELthrew inan obscure reference--take the BUFFY season seven episode when some of the characters are playing D&D, and Andrew refers to "Trogdor the Burninator," a monster from HOMESTAR RUNNER www.homestarrunner.com (http://www.homestarrunner.com). You know: the sort of obscure allusions that only a few geeks, nerds, and, er, hip spec fic writers would catch.)


http://ozment.livejournal.com
http://manning.coldfusionvideo.com
www.myspace.com/ozmentshouseoftwilight (http://www.myspace.com/ozmentshouseoftwilight)

[Jeff Stehman]

erazmus said...
The electricity girl
The groosalugg (grew-a-slug we called him, for his eyebrow)
Detective Lockley
Gotta disagree with these. They were resolved, especially the last two. Dennis was also resolved in terms of the show--no Cordelia, no apartment, and we got to see his reaction to that. And the crazy slayer was a one-episode monster.

Nicholas, I recognized the name, but I wasn't sure they were going for the Groo reference, since the Groosalugg was so un-Groo like. Could be.

--Jeff Stehman

[erazmus]

I felt all were at least ripe for reprisal.
Mike

Michael D. Turner
'Psyched Up' in _Turn the other Chick_-ed. E. Friesner-Baen books
www.baen.com
'Dutchman Rescue'in Continuum SF #6
www.continuumsciencefiction.com/orders.htm (http://www.continuumsciencefiction.com/orders.htm)

'An Incident at Black Tongue Tavern' in _Bash Down the Door and Slice Open the Badguy_ from Fantasist Enterprises:

www.fantasistent.com/books/anthologies/BASH.php (http://www.fantasistent.com/books/anthologies/BASH.php)
'Stains' in Tales of the Talisman 3-1 www.zianet.com/hadrosaur/index.html (http://www.zianet.com/hadrosaur/index.html)
'Slushpiles' in Between the Kisses
www.samsdotpublishing.com/betweenkisses/TurnerSlushPileS.htm (http://www.samsdotpublishing.com/betweenkisses/TurnerSlushPileS.htm)

[Jeff Stehman]

I would have loved to see the Groosalugg come back, and there were apparently discussions to get him back for a couple of episodes in season four, but no dice. Personally, I think he would have made a great addition to the final episode. Gather all the champions you can.

--Jeff Stehman